UBB.Developers Forums General Discussion Suggestions and Feedback Pricing, licensing and open source

My thoughts on this issue are as follows:

1. Up until yesterday, W3T had been a collaborative effort between the user community and Scream. To a degree it was an open-source project, with the user community paying very reasonable fees to enable Scream to work on W3T. No one minded doing so, since they realized that this was a labor of love for Scream, and they did not begrudge the reasonable payments since we knew Scream could not continue without financial support. As of today, these circumstances have radically changed.

2. I suspect that the reason pricing and licensing details are not forthcoming, is that the new powers-that-be are in the process of trying to figure out how to provide as little as possible for as much money as possible. This may sound harsh, and perhaps someone from Infopop can respond and tell me just how wrong I am and let us know that licensing and pricing will NOT change for the worse.

3. It seems to me that Scream is aware of the importance of the pricing and licensing issues to his users. It also seems to me that, if he was really looking out for our best interests as he has said he is, he could have ensured that these two questions were settled prior to his sale of W3T. IOW, Scream could have made it a condition of his sale that licensing and pricing remain close to current levels. I'm sure he got other terms nailed down (such as the sum to be paid to him by Infopop), why not the terms that most matter to the users?

I apologize if this is seen as insulting to Scream. I do not mean it to be, after-all, I have been a fan and supporter of Scream and this software for years. I also think that my questions need to be asked. It seems that things are now about business.

4. I have seen a number of posts that accuse UBB of shoddy business practices (some with quite specific complaints such as this one) and overpriced products. I have yet to see anyone from UBB address these issues, even if just to say that the complaints are unwarranted. If the state of UBB is as these posters state (overpriced products, poor support, buggy code, etc.), then how will things change just because they added a piece of code to their stable?

5. Changing the name of W3T to UBBThreads is a short-sighted move. I have never understood why the first move after a purchase is always for corporate types to feel the need to slap their mark on the new fire hydrant. They can't even answer legitimate questions from the user base, but that's ok, now they have the product tagged. The folks at Infopop don't seem to understand that a majority of their new user base rejected their product on their way to W3T, I know I certainly did, after laughing at their ridiculous prices and licensing terms. So what makes them think that we will be attracted to a name that, for many of us, stands for a sucky, overpriced, underfeatured product with poor support? I would recommend that the name issue be reconsidered.

The current move is akin to Microsoft buying the Linux kernel and then calling it Microsoft Linux. Sure they can't answer any questions as to the future of Linux, but they are bound to impress the Linux community of their great intentions regarding Linux. After all, in their minds, who could possibly dislike a Microsoft product?

6. I believe this move on the part of Scream, as well-intentioned as it is, illustrates the need for users to support products released under GPL licenses.

7. This site contains the sum total of a lot of work and contribution from the W3T community. There is a significant amount of valuable information stored here (hacks, bug fixes, installation instructions, style sheets, installer info, etc.) which I don't think anyone wants to lose. I would recommend that you keep this site open until you are able to transfer the content to a different location. Of course, if you don't change the name of the software, there shouldn't be any need to change the site ;)

Finally, I wish Scream and us (the users of W3T) the best. I truly hope that Scream's goals are realized, and that we can have an improved product with flexible licensing and reasonable pricing.

Again, I apologize if my wording sounds harsh. I appreciate everything that we have accomplished together, and I must admit I am disappointed by the news. I hope it all works out.

I totally agree about the name... UBBThreads makes no sense. Your point about what UBB means to us (and many professionals in the industry), is quite valid and I would think that the acquisition of W3T would be a fantastic chance for InfoPop to improve their reputation and perhaps sell a ton of licenses to current UBB license holders who stopped using the product for the reasons that their reputation is what it is. I don't think the point about the name can be stressed enough. I really hope the InfoPop people are listening, but I've yet to see a word mentioned about the name.

This point is to HELP them and W3T, not be critical or anti-InfoPop.

Pricing will be announced next week. Launch date is set for next Thursday, by the way.

Though I cannot give you exact pricing now, I can tell you that it will be affordable.

Ted--

Your post gives me, for one, no comfort, although I suspect you meant that it would ease fears.

If you want to ease fears here (maybe that is not important to you?) then you could have been a lot more specific about pricing, and you could have not completely ducked the naming issue.

What do I mean by a lot more specific about pricing? You could have: A. told us some of the considerations, such as a complete review of pricing on all Infopop's products, or a survey of interested users or competitive products; B. said that the range of possibilities were someplace between a 20% to 30% increase, or that you were still considering an actual decrease in the price of W3T; C. shared with us who all (if not by name, at least by title or function) would have input into the decision; D. told us that you consider W3T to be the top, middle or bottom of your product line; E. and a hundred other similar things.

So do you intend to be responsive to your users (us)?

It seems to me this is one of Jan Carlzon's Moments of Truth for your organization....

I'll answer for Ted real quickly because they are still working on getting their website changed. The final announcement on pricing will be on next Thursday I believe when the new website is ready to roll. The FAQ they posted on the board addressed the questions that were raised by then and I'm sure new questions will get answered as well.

Seems a bunch of us share the same views on this, and are getting the same feeling from Ted and co. *sigh*

Some things never change. Don't expect it to improve either.